NJ Transit's double-decker schedule

[JohnnyCJohnny]

In case you were wondering what the schedule is for NJ Transit's
double-decker train on the NEC, it's mentioned in this article.

NJ Transit's double-decker train rolling

A New Jersey Transit police officer watches a new multilevel train
arrive Dec. 11 at New York's Penn Station. train cars feature extra
room, wider seats and no middle seats. and will appear next spring,
first on the busiest lines, such as North Jersey Coast Line, Midtown
Direct Service on the Morris and Essex lines and the Montclair Boonton
line, said Dan Stessel, a spokesman for NJ Transit. (AP Photo/Mike
Derer)AP By Judy Rife

Times Herald-Record
December 19, 2006
So how soon will Orange County commuters get to ride in one of NJ
Transit's new $1.9 million double-decker cars?

Imagine: An extra inch of knee room and an extra two inches of seat
width than the Comet Vs that Metro-North and NJ Transit put into
service only three years ago. And no middle seat!

They can ride in one right now, if they want to adjust their morning
commute to accommodate the schedule of the one and only train of
bi-level cars that started service last week.

The six-car train will make three runs between Trenton and Pennsylvania
Station in Midtown every day. The first, as the 5:10 a.m. from Trenton,
will not stop at Secaucus Junction. The second, as the 6:31 to Trenton,
will stop at Secaucus at 6:40 to collect commuters bound for other New
Jersey points. And the third, as the 8:51 to New York, will stop at
Secaucus at 9:55 - and here is where regular Port Jervis line
customers have their best shot.

The 7:38 Metro-North train from Port Jervis reaches Secaucus at 9:35
and commuters routinely transfer to a NJ Transit train that stops at
9:44 for the short trip to Penn Station. But if they hang around until
9:55, well, they can ride in one of the new double-decker cars.

"Customers seemed genuinely impressed," said Dan Stessel, a NJ Transit
spokesman, about the train's inaugural run. NJ Transit expects to
receive enough additional bi-level cars to put two or three more trains
into service by spring. Then Bombardier Transportation will be
delivering the cars at the rate of a train a month through the end of
2008 when all 234 cars will be in service.

The investment is being made to carry NJ Transit's growing ridership
through the next decade, until a new tunnel beneath the Hudson River
and a new station in Midtown are built.

Amtrak's 100-year-old tunnel and Penn Station are operating beyond
capacity and the only way NJ Transit can deliver more commuters to the
city is to resort to cars that can hold 15 percent to 20 percent more
customers.

http://www.recordonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20061219/BIZ/612190301

[Michael Finfer]

Post by JohnnyCJohnny
In case you were wondering what the schedule is for NJ Transit's
double-decker train on the NEC, it's mentioned in this article.

Last I heard, it ran to NY as train 3910,the 5:10 AM out of Trenton,
arriving at 6:16 AM, and then it ran a round trip to Trenton. I would
guess that it would run as train 3819, leaving at 6:49 and arriving
Trenton at 8:10. That looks like that would put them on train 3932,
3934, or 3936 coming back, depending upon how much time is needed to
make that turn. After that, I don't know.

That was information I got last week, so it may have changed.

Michael Finfer
Bridgewater, NJ

[h***@bbs.cpcn.com]

Post by Michael Finfer
Last I heard, it ran to NY as train 3910,the 5:10 AM out of Trenton,
arriving at 6:16 AM, and then it ran a round trip to Trenton. I would
guess that it would run as train 3819, leaving at 6:49 and arriving
Trenton at 8:10. That looks like that would put them on train 3932,
3934, or 3936 coming back, depending upon how much time is needed to
make that turn. After that, I don't know.

Thanks for the info.

I'm curious as if the train can hold a local schedule. Also, if the
train can carry more passengers than at present. That is, will they
run a ten car train of double-deckers in place of a ten car train of
single-level and maintain existing local schedules?

I can't help but suspect we won't see that, but rather merely an eight
car train replacing a ten car train, so NO increase in capacity at all.
(Hopefully someone will prove me wrong on this.) Of course, NJT
could double-head locomotives, but I really doubt they'll do that.

[JohnnyCJohnny]

Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com

Post by Michael Finfer
Last I heard, it ran to NY as train 3910,the 5:10 AM out of Trenton,
arriving at 6:16 AM, and then it ran a round trip to Trenton. I would
guess that it would run as train 3819, leaving at 6:49 and arriving
Trenton at 8:10. That looks like that would put them on train 3932,
3934, or 3936 coming back, depending upon how much time is needed to
make that turn. After that, I don't know.

Thanks for the info.
I'm curious as if the train can hold a local schedule. Also, if the
train can carry more passengers than at present. That is, will they
run a ten car train of double-deckers in place of a ten car train of
single-level and maintain existing local schedules?
I can't help but suspect we won't see that, but rather merely an eight
car train replacing a ten car train, so NO increase in capacity at all.

...

Interesting take. A normal rush hour train on the NEC is eight cars
right? I often see ten car trains on busy weekends. Sometimes it
seems like they are running twelve car MU trains on weekends.

If they replace a ten car MU train with an eight car double-decker
train, the capacity of the train sets is the same and no benefit is
derived from the double-decker cars. More likely, the double-decker
cars were purchased because of a cozy relationship between NJ Transit
and the car builders who bribe the politicians for contracts. It
remains to be seen if the double-decker cars actually add capacity to
the NJ Transit system. They do look nice though. The seats look more
comfortable than those straight-back MU seats.

[h***@bbs.cpcn.com]

Post by JohnnyCJohnny
Interesting take. A normal rush hour train on the NEC is eight cars
right?

Could be anything between 6-12 cars. Usually 8-10.

Post by JohnnyCJohnny
I often see ten car trains on busy weekends. Sometimes it
seems like they are running twelve car MU trains on weekends.

Weekends now are mostly 10 cars, sometimes 8, sometimes 12. No
consistent pattern. As a passenger, it's hard to discern loading and
distribution. It's possible some cars aren't open.

Post by JohnnyCJohnny
If they replace a ten car MU train with an eight car double-decker
train, the capacity of the train sets is the same and no benefit is
derived from the double-decker cars.

Yep.

Post by JohnnyCJohnny
More likely, the double-decker
cars were purchased because of a cozy relationship between NJ Transit
and the car builders who bribe the politicians for contracts.

Not likely at all. Such contracts are under intense scrutiny by many
people external to NJT as well as other vendors who would quickly cry
foul.

Post by JohnnyCJohnny
It
remains to be seen if the double-decker cars actually add capacity to
the NJ Transit system.

I found the address of a reporter who covers commuting and will send
him my concerns.

[Michael Finfer]

Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
I'm curious as if the train can hold a local schedule.

That's one of my big questions as well. Notice that all of the
schedules that I mentioned are limited stop expresses. I don't think
we'll know for a few months since there are only six cars available, and
the next batch is not supposed to be in service until February.

I assume that the ALP-46's will have no problem with a six car bilevel
train. If we're going to see problems, it's going to be when they try
to run 10 car or longer trains.

Does anyone know the maximum train length NJT is running on the NEC?

Michael Finfer
Bridgewater, NJ

[Joseph D. Korman]

Post by Michael Finfer

Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
I'm curious as if the train can hold a local schedule.

That's one of my big questions as well. Notice that all of the
schedules that I mentioned are limited stop expresses. I don't think
we'll know for a few months since there are only six cars available, and
the next batch is not supposed to be in service until February.
I assume that the ALP-46's will have no problem with a six car bilevel
train. If we're going to see problems, it's going to be when they try
to run 10 car or longer trains.
Does anyone know the maximum train length NJT is running on the NEC?
Michael Finfer
Bridgewater, NJ

...

Not definitive, but on Monday I saw eight cars on locomotive trains and
ten cars on MU's. That was from about 9:00am to 2:00pm at Edison and
New Brunswick. I don't know if these are maximums.

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[h***@bbs.cpcn.com]

Post by Michael Finfer
Does anyone know the maximum train length NJT is running on the NEC?

I don't know officially, but my observation is that its 12 car MUs and
10 car locomotive pulled.

Train length is not consistent. On one day a given train be 8 cars and
another day its 12 cars.

On 12 car trains, I don't know if all cars are open.

When I was younger I'd walk through an entire train as it was leaving
NYC to sense its loading and dispersion. Too cumbersome to do so
nowadays.

Another issue I'm troubled about on the new cars is finding seats.
Presently, you just keep walking until you see an empty seat. But on
the double deckers, you can't really tell in advance if the upper level
or lower level has seats unless you poke your head down and that will
disrupt the line of people behind you looking for seats.

I wonder what the experience is in Chicago and Long Island.

[Michael Finfer]

Post by h***@bbs.cpcn.com
I wonder what the experience is in Chicago and Long Island.

I've ridden in the METRA gallery cars, and it's not so much of a
problem. You can get an idea of how many people are up there from
below. Upper level seating is limited in those cars, one across on each
side of the upper level. It sounds like NJT's bilevels are four across
on both levels.

Michael Finfer
Bridgewater, NJ